In complete defiance of all those over the years who have complained that I never write about anything important, here is a ripped-from-the-headlines discussion of the Oxford comma, also known as the “serial comma.” The summary of the discussion is as follows: anyone who uses the serial comma is one of the Chosen; anyone who doesn’t is a mutton head.
The serial comma is where you use a comma after the last item in a sentence to designate a list. For example:
“Greg blogs about wheat, toads, and potstickers.”
Here’s the same sentence without the serial comma:
“Greg blogs about wheat, toads and potstickers.”
Note how that sentence is completely confusing. Why does “wheat” get its own little special space of the universe, while “toads” and “potstickers” are jammed together like frat boys in the back of a pickup? Are those two items somehow connected? Is there a cosmic meaning that one should derive from their breathless union?
Of course not, and that’s why each item needs a comma. Those items are begging for a comma. If they don’t have a comma, they don’t look right. You stare at them and you sense something wrong. Something out of place. Something that strikes at the core of their identity. Like Lindsay Lohan with an alcohol monitoring bracelet.
The problem is, there’s no consensus. Most grammar books will say “Whatever, you can do it both ways.” However, before you shrug off responsibility for the issue and embrace the ambiguity, let’s take a look at two people who dislike the serial comma. You will see why it is not wise to align yourself with their camp.
1) Lynn Truss, author of the best-selling grammar book Eats, Shoots & Leaves. Despite the title of her book being an homage to the confusion caused by the lack of the serial comma, she writes: “My own feeling is that one shouldn’t be too rigid about the Oxford comma. Sometimes the sentence is improved by including it; sometimes it isn’t.” Whatever. Truss is from Britain, where the serial comma is typically not used, so her opinion is worthless. The Brits weren’t that wishy washy about taking over the world, were they? The sun no longer rises and sets on the British empire, and it’s all because of their highly problematic handling of the serial comma.
2) Some jerk at a job interview several years ago. I was applying for a communications position at PeopleSoft, and one of the first questions my interviewer asked me was my opinion on the Oxford comma. I said I used it; he said that he didn’t. And what happened a few years later? Oracle bought PeopleSoft and fired most of its employees. And why? Opinions vary, but I believe it’s because PeopleSoft didn’t use the serial comma.
Now, to be fair, a Wikipedia article on the subject does give some interesting examples of confusion that is created by the use of the serial comma. But these examples are flawed. Here’s one of the sentences used to show the potential problems of the serial comma:
“To my mother, Ayn Rand and God.”
The meaning of this sentence is clear. This is obviously a list of three. But if the serial comma is used:
“To my mother, Ayn Rand, and God. “
The commas appear to be setting off “Ayn Rand” from the rest of the items, suggesting that the writer’s mother is Ayn Rand. This serves to confuse rather than clarify the sentence.
My response? Give me a break, Wikipedia; Ayn Rand was a windbag who wrote character speeches that literally went on for sixty pages. If you were Ayn Rand’s child, you would not be dedicating things to her; you would be in therapy. Therefore, it’s impossible to read the sentence to mean that the writer’s mother is Ayn Rand, which serves to prove my point that the serial comma is always correct and its omission is always wrong.
As we head into another election season, it will be the responsibility of each and every citizen to choose allegiances and make decisions. To do that, you must first find out who you are. I mean--who you really are. Are you a proponent of the serial comma? Or are you one of the rump-fed ratbrain maggot pies who seek to destroy civilization as we know it? Be the former. Join us. We are waiting for you.
We are happy, hopeful, and enlightened.
win.
I thought you blogged about “wheat toads, and potstickers.” I truly love to heat my sliced bread until it’s charcoal covered, slather it with butter, and then enjoy buttered wheat toads.
I can see the use for the serial comma and use it. However, aren’t “and” and “but” both conjunctions and connect the first portion of the sentence to the second and therefore do not need a comma? (Conjunction junction, what’s your function?)
In fact, authors that are comparing or contrasting just two things and use a comma between them, drive me far crazier than the use of the serial comma.
I laughed so hard at Ayn Rand. Thanks for that, Greg.
Wow, I learned something new today. If someone asked me yesterday how I felt about Oxford commas I would have had no idea what they were talking about. I feel enlightened!
Of course now I’m also comma self-conscious.
I am in the don’t-use-that-second-comma camp.
And some people think Ayn Rand is God. Not me, though.
my personal opinion on the serial comma is that i want to marry it and have all of its serial comma babies.
but maybe that’s just me.
dude. the serial comma is ridiculous and should not be used. and i love commas. and semicolons. semicolons should be used more often.
after reading this post i feel smarterer already. thanks, captain o-comma!
Actually, you should not use the comma if the list is of single words, but you should if it is a list of phrases.
So:
He eats, shoots and leaves.
But:
I like to dance for joy, sing for my supper, and whistle in the dark.
This is the correct thing to do; disagree with me, and you are a foolish, idiotic and stupid.
Now let’s move on.
My partner and i actually started a website to advocate for rights for robot-pet hybirds and we actually argue and dig at each other quite frequently about this exact point. (he’s a non-user of the serial comma. his snobby excuse: he works for the media and they don’t use it) i am going to send him this link just to rub my supreme rightness in his face. we are very much in love.
It’s true; I do love that woman of mine, the previous poster. We’re like the Carville and Matalin of the grammar set.
Wow, I didn’t know such passion for the comma existed. I’m going to back away very slowly now.
Legal reason to use the Oxford comma:
In a will, the “estate is to be split evenly between Jane, John & Joe”
Which translates to Jane could potentially go to court to guarentee getting half for herself while the boys split the other half between themselves.
Had that extra comma been used than each would recieve 1/3 or the estate.
Tina, nice. I was going to respond to Tinea that her rule regarding list of phrases, although amiable and comforting, doesn’t tackle the key issue of unclear meaning.
But now I feel as though this is all trivial and pointless considering the larger issue facing us: robot-pet hybrids. We must ALL become advocates.
Tina elucidates why any lawyer worth his salt would write, “estate is left to Jane, Joh and Joe, each to receive one-third share” Or “estate is left to Jane, John, and Joe, each to receive one-third share.” No ambiguity either way. Holographic wills, howevr, are another story. Now, somebody enlighten me on “robot-pet hybrids.”
Well Papa Goose, we at http://www.equalitynowforrobotpethybrids.com believe that it is important to protect against Potential disaster when it comes to the inevitable hybridization of robots and our pets. We explain everything in the mission. Greg is now third in line after Huey Lewis and/or the News to be asked to be our spokesperson. Fingers crosssed! (Oh and my partner oh so lovingly mentioned how poor not only my grammer but my punctuation as well was in my last post. So sorry and thanks dear.)
I’m with you Greg, but I’m not sure if I have a good reason. I learned to use the additional comma, and I keep using it out of habit. I’m also into colons, semi colons, and dashes typed properly.
I shall never use the soi-disant serial comma. Nor shall I spell organisation with the zed of illiteracy.
Fie to your curses and slanders.
Good day, sir!
Hmm...i used both the serial comma and two spaces at the beginning of a sentence until the Chicago Manual told me it was preferable not to. I always kinda liked that comma. But I do everything the Chicago Manual of Style tells me to. (because who could come up with a cool name for a grammar book....and yet they did). And yes, if the Chicago Manual of style told me to go write---off, ["a (bridge)"] I would.
I loathe the serial comma. Just sayin’.
I found your argument to be persuasive, compelling, and convincing.
But what is your opinion on the greengrocer’s apostrophe, O Grammar Guru?
(I hate it, but am very much in favor of serial commas.)
Heh, I hadn’t heard that atrocity called the greengrocer’s apostrophe before. But you know who else does it? CD and DVD joints. It’s always “CD’s for sale.” What are they possessing that requires such an apostrophe? It is one of life’s big mysteries.
AP style requires that we DON’T use the comma before the “and.”
AND if I want my news releases picked up, I’m doing it their way.
Alright now, I see 25 other people already brung it and I am never going to be a paradigm of grammar. However, I teach Kindergarten. In Kindergarten we teach kids to capitalize proper names. The best Kindergarten example of this is Daddy and Mommy. If in the non serial comma example, the word mother was capitalized you would read mother as a proper name and therefore not confuse mother with Ayn Rand or God.
Mother, Ayn Rand, and God
Please try to overlook any comma mis-usage or other offensive grammar gaffs in the above comment. I am going to go pour myself another glass of wine. I always use the comma before and.
Commas became newsworthy today. Legal Times, a newspaper about (surpise!) legal issues reports that the use of commas in the Second Amendment is a critical factor in the Supreme Court’s consideration whether to grant review to the District of Columbia Appeals Court decision to overturn the District’s gun ban on grounds it violates the Second Amendment. Arcane debate about differences in usage of commas in 1791 and now are involving not just legal scholars but grammarians and historians.
My aplogies to anyone offended by introduction of a serious topic.
It’s been so long since I’ve been here and yes I’m ashamed but frat boys jam packed in a pickup lessens the guilt a bit. Hi Greg!
I’m in the serial comma camp too.
Those style manuals are geared toward reducing space, I think. At the expense of readability, I think. To remove helpful commas (and I don’t mean comma splices) and the 2nd space between sentences? Humbug.
If Ayn Rand is not your mother, you could add words: “To my mother, to Ayn Rand, and to God.”
--Lisa S.
Yeah!
And if that list is so confusing, just change the order in which you list the items. Put your mother last. (Just in the list, of course.)
In the first example, I thought you were calling your readers “toads and potstickers”.